Remove trees from player bases on ALL random maps

[historic_bruno]

We need to check every random map script and make sure clumps of trees or other resources are not placed too near the base. Reasons: it restricts building area for both players and AIs, and it obstructs the player's view of the game. A few scattered trees would be OK, but even those should be far enough away to be able to see the base and freely move units.

The scenarios are for the most part good examples of how a player's base area should look.

[O.Davoodi]

In 11895:

Gathers all the trees near the player start position near each other to make more room for players. Fixes #1408.

[O.Davoodi]

I didn't remove the trees. Instead I gathered them and made a small forest near the player so that a lot of room is made.

[historic_bruno]

The problems still exist :P As an example, here's the default random map with default settings at the start of the game: ​http://i.imgur.com/lAa9B.jpg

Several things are wrong. First, my starting units are obscured, which is a lesser concern. The bigger problem is that huge clump of trees right next to the civil center, meaning I can't build there. The thing is there's really no need for that clump at all, the slightly farther forest in the background is good enough. Also the foremost clump is right on top of my berry bushes and the distant clump is on top of a stone mine so they aren't accessible :( There's far too many trees IMO.

I think every map no matter the size should have a minimum distance for trees of X tiles from the civil center. Maybe 1-2 trees would be OK in the red circle of the above screenshot.

[O.Davoodi]

Replying to historic_bruno:

Several things are wrong. First, my starting units are obscured, which is a lesser concern. The bigger problem is that huge clump of trees right next to the civil center, meaning I can't build there. The thing is there's really no need for that clump at all, the slightly farther forest in the background is good enough. Also the foremost clump is right on top of my berry bushes and the distant clump is on top of a stone mine so they aren't accessible :( There's far too many trees IMO.

I think every map no matter the size should have a minimum distance for trees of X tiles from the civil center. Maybe 1-2 trees would be OK in the red circle of the above screenshot.

That forest in the background wont necessarily be there. The bug with the mines is not a general bug. I'll fix it.

So you mean I should reduce the number of trees to 1-2? It won't be hard but this is a random map after all and forests are not always placed near the start location of the player. It means that you may need to travel a lot to find one.

The problems you pointed are mostly related to Aegean Sea itself. I'll find all other similar maps with such thick forests and reduce the number to 1-2.

And about the nearness of those trees, in open maps, it doesn't bother the player. In close maps like Aegean Sea, it does and as I said, I'm going to fix them. But in fact, we have a bunch of trees near the player base in many existing scenarios with open areas (e.g. Punjab).

Try other "open" random maps to see that these small bunches of tree are actually necessary.

[O.Davoodi]

I fixed the maps in the way I stated above in [11897]. Also fixed a bug that caused the mines to appear in forests in larger maps. Set this as close if you see it fixed.

[FeXoR]

I don't know a good solution for this either. On deep forest I placed 3 food/wood sources and 1 stone/metal source in a slightly randomized circle near the start positions (which looks not that good/generic/random) but enough space to e.g. place some Farms next to the Civil Centre. Any other object avoids being in a distance smaller then 20 RMS tiles (80 engine units) to the start locations to have space for other base buildings.

I'd like to have no entities but e.g. pigs/chicken inside that radius (for most maps with less dense forests 15 RMS tiles would be enough I think). Would it be that bad if players had to scout a bit for resources right at the beginning? With the phases in now I don't think it would be that bad.

[historic_bruno]

Replying to Spahbod:

I fixed the maps in the way I stated above in [11897]. Also fixed a bug that caused the mines to appear in forests in larger maps. Set this as close if you see it fixed.

Thanks, they seem much improved in terms of building space :) It's still possible for clumps of tall trees to block the view (try Lake, 4 players, normal size, seed 2670). Could we have a sort of cone around the initial camera where tree clumps are restricted? Mostly for aesthetics, I don't think players should start with a bunch of trees blocking the view.

When I said there are too many trees, I meant in the area directly around the player base, of course some maps will have more or less trees :)

Replying to FeXoR:

I'd like to have no entities but e.g. pigs/chicken inside that radius (for most maps with less dense forests 15 RMS tiles would be enough I think). Would it be that bad if players had to scout a bit for resources right at the beginning? With the phases in now I don't think it would be that bad.

Sounds reasonable to me, that's part of what exploring is for.

[FeXoR]

Added "Random map design tips and conventions" to: ​http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Rmgen_Library#Randommapdesigntipsandconventions

[O.Davoodi]

In 12030:

Prevents trees to block the view of players. Refs #1408.

[O.Davoodi]

Replying to historic_bruno:

Thanks, they seem much improved in terms of building space :) It's still possible for clumps of tall trees to block the view (try Lake, 4 players, normal size, seed 2670). Could we have a sort of cone around the initial camera where tree clumps are restricted? Mostly for aesthetics, I don't think players should start with a bunch of trees blocking the view.

Fixed in 12030. Is there any more problem?

[historic_bruno]

Replying to FeXoR:

Added "Random map design tips and conventions" to: ​http://trac.wildfiregames.com/wiki/Rmgen_Library#Randommapdesigntipsandconventions

Thanks, I didn't notice that :) I moved them to Random_Map_Generator since they're good general tips. If we end up with enough tips, we can create a new page (a tutorial for creating a random map script would be nice).

[historic_bruno]

Replying to Spahbod:

Fixed in 12030. Is there any more problem?

They look much better now, I think this ticket can be closed.